A majority of Americans believe forcing Ukraine to give up territory to Russia, while limiting the size of its army would be unacceptable conditions of any peace deal with Moscow, a new poll found.…
1/3 of eligible voters went for Trump. Another 1/3 stayed home or made protest votes. Of those who didn’t vote for either party, the vast majority were (de)motivated by straight up apathy. Those trying to teach the Democrats (or Republicans) a lesson were probably the least significant bloc of all, yet some people seem stuck on blaming them for the outcome.
The fault lies with the Democratic establishment that pissed away every opportunity to win what should have been an easy victory. They really had to work to loose that election. If you really want to blame the voters, then start with Trump voters and the Democratic voters who nominated Biden in 2020.
Why stick with just one or the other? I’d rather blame every party that did their best to put Trump in power, whether intentionally or not.
And, like it or not, those who made it their mission to vilify anyone who had a chance of keeping Trump and his cronies from taking power are to blame. I’m perfectly willing to throw people who valued their ideals over pragmatism right under that bus where they belong.
I’d rather blame every party that did their best to put Trump in power, whether intentionally or not.
But you didn’t. You blamed one tiny segment of voters.
The Republican and Democratic establishments are both to blame, but they are largely the same group. The Republican establishment just lost control of their populists while the Democratic establishment lost the loyalty of theirs.
Trump himself has never been the real problem. He’s just a symptom of the rot in both establishments. He is doing very little that wasn’t already where we were headed. At worst he sped up the process a bit.
Trump totally screwed the pooch with tariffs and international relations. He’s screwed up ukrane/russia, and he’s screwing up Venezuela, and he’s screwed up relations with Canada for decades. This is very different from the path the U.S. was on. I also don’t buy that the U.S. was headed to fascism with military on the streets, and ICE taking naturalized citizens off the streets violently. So no, the parties are not the same. At all.
And specifically villainizing the idiots who helped Trump win by ‘protest’ voting against the democrats is valid. These are people who claim to want what’s good for the country, they seem to understand the issues, but made absolutely moronic voting decision and then often claim some sort of moral superiority. They need to be educated/shamed so that they might do better next election if we actually get one.
What about villainizing the idiots running the Democratic party who insisted on running bad candidates with bad policy.
They need to be educated/shamed so that they might do better next election if we actually get one.
Yeah man, I’m sure spending the next three years making them fucking hate you even more than they already do will definitely make them more likely to fall inline next time: “on the one hand, the Democrats are still genocidal agents of the ultra wealthy, but on the other hand, some self righteous dumbass online was really condescending and rude to me, so I guess I’ll vote for them!”
That’s why I said he is doing “very little” and not “nothing” that wasn’t where we were already headed. Trump has been a national embarrassment in regards to Ukraine, but I’m not sure he’s really hurt them. It’s not like Biden was doing a great job there. Venezuela has been “screwed up” for a very long time, and the US is largely responsible for that - both Democrats and Republicans.
I also don’t buy that the U.S. was headed to fascism with military on the streets
Then you haven’t been paying attention. What do you think the militarization of police has all been about? That’s something that Republicans and Democrats have both been pushing, right alongside mass surveillance. Look into how the “Cop City” protests were responded to.
and ICE taking naturalized citizens off the streets violently
Trump is a far worse than any Democrat on that front, but lets not pretend ICE wasn’t draconian under Biden as well.
So no, the parties are not the same. At all.
WTF? Why is it impossible to have any kind of discussion about the Democratic establishment without this bullshit? Where did I say both parties are the same? They are very different, but the dynamic between the two has always been leading us to certain inevitable outcomes. Republicans push politics to the right, while Democrats follow the polls and don’t try to lead the country anywhere. The end result is a steady march to the right.
And specifically villainizing the idiots who helped Trump win by ‘protest’ voting against the democrats is valid.
I think the term “villain” is a little over the top, but I didn’t criticize you for calling them out, I criticized you for calling them out exclusively. That’s a toxic attitude and a strong indicator of establishment brain-rot. It’s repeating the exact mistakes that drove people away from voting for Democrats in the first place. You aren’t trying to win elections, you are being smug. I hold you personally more responsible for Trump’s win than any protest voter. A curse on you both.
1/3 of eligible voters went for Trump. Another 1/3 stayed home or made protest votes. Of those who didn’t vote for either party, the vast majority were (de)motivated by straight up apathy. Those trying to teach the Democrats (or Republicans) a lesson were probably the least significant bloc of all, yet some people seem stuck on blaming them for the outcome.
The fault lies with the Democratic establishment that pissed away every opportunity to win what should have been an easy victory. They really had to work to loose that election. If you really want to blame the voters, then start with Trump voters and the Democratic voters who nominated Biden in 2020.
Why stick with just one or the other? I’d rather blame every party that did their best to put Trump in power, whether intentionally or not.
And, like it or not, those who made it their mission to vilify anyone who had a chance of keeping Trump and his cronies from taking power are to blame. I’m perfectly willing to throw people who valued their ideals over pragmatism right under that bus where they belong.
But you didn’t. You blamed one tiny segment of voters.
The Republican and Democratic establishments are both to blame, but they are largely the same group. The Republican establishment just lost control of their populists while the Democratic establishment lost the loyalty of theirs.
Trump himself has never been the real problem. He’s just a symptom of the rot in both establishments. He is doing very little that wasn’t already where we were headed. At worst he sped up the process a bit.
Trump totally screwed the pooch with tariffs and international relations. He’s screwed up ukrane/russia, and he’s screwing up Venezuela, and he’s screwed up relations with Canada for decades. This is very different from the path the U.S. was on. I also don’t buy that the U.S. was headed to fascism with military on the streets, and ICE taking naturalized citizens off the streets violently. So no, the parties are not the same. At all.
And specifically villainizing the idiots who helped Trump win by ‘protest’ voting against the democrats is valid. These are people who claim to want what’s good for the country, they seem to understand the issues, but made absolutely moronic voting decision and then often claim some sort of moral superiority. They need to be educated/shamed so that they might do better next election if we actually get one.
What about villainizing the idiots running the Democratic party who insisted on running bad candidates with bad policy.
Yeah man, I’m sure spending the next three years making them fucking hate you even more than they already do will definitely make them more likely to fall inline next time: “on the one hand, the Democrats are still genocidal agents of the ultra wealthy, but on the other hand, some self righteous dumbass online was really condescending and rude to me, so I guess I’ll vote for them!”
That’s why I said he is doing “very little” and not “nothing” that wasn’t where we were already headed. Trump has been a national embarrassment in regards to Ukraine, but I’m not sure he’s really hurt them. It’s not like Biden was doing a great job there. Venezuela has been “screwed up” for a very long time, and the US is largely responsible for that - both Democrats and Republicans.
Then you haven’t been paying attention. What do you think the militarization of police has all been about? That’s something that Republicans and Democrats have both been pushing, right alongside mass surveillance. Look into how the “Cop City” protests were responded to.
Trump is a far worse than any Democrat on that front, but lets not pretend ICE wasn’t draconian under Biden as well.
WTF? Why is it impossible to have any kind of discussion about the Democratic establishment without this bullshit? Where did I say both parties are the same? They are very different, but the dynamic between the two has always been leading us to certain inevitable outcomes. Republicans push politics to the right, while Democrats follow the polls and don’t try to lead the country anywhere. The end result is a steady march to the right.
I think the term “villain” is a little over the top, but I didn’t criticize you for calling them out, I criticized you for calling them out exclusively. That’s a toxic attitude and a strong indicator of establishment brain-rot. It’s repeating the exact mistakes that drove people away from voting for Democrats in the first place. You aren’t trying to win elections, you are being smug. I hold you personally more responsible for Trump’s win than any protest voter. A curse on you both.